User talk:Crook1

Welcome

Hello, Crook1, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions to this free encyclopedia. If you decide that you need help, check out Getting Help below, ask at the help desk, or place {{Help me}} on your talk page and ask your question there. Please remember to sign your name on talk pages by clicking or or by typing four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your username and the date. Also, please do your best to always fill in the edit summary field. Below are some useful links to facilitate your involvement. Happy editing! The garmine (talk) 02:11, 19 June 2017 (UTC) Getting started Introduction Contributing to Wikipedia The five pillars of Wikipedia How to edit a page Intuitive guide to Wikipedia Finding your way around Table of contents Department directory Help directory Editing articles How to develop an article Simplified Manual of Style Getting help Frequently asked questions Cheatsheet Our new user help forum, the Teahouse Where to ask a question Help pages New contributors' help page Article Wizard – a Wizard to help you create articles How you can help Community Portal Join a WikiProject Follow Wikipedia etiquette Practice civility Discover what's going on in the Wikimedia community

A page you started (Italian submarine Dagabur) has been reviewed!

Thanks for creating Italian submarine Dagabur, Crook1!

Wikipedia editor Blythwood just reviewed your page, and wrote this note for you:

I've linked to the Italian article on the same topic.

To reply, leave a comment on Blythwood's talk page.

Learn more about page curation.

Blythwood (talk) 03:17, 27 June 2017 (UTC)

A page you started (Italian submarine Malachite) has been reviewed!

Thanks for creating Italian submarine Malachite, Crook1!

Wikipedia editor Anoptimistix just reviewed your page, and wrote this note for you:

Appreciate your contributions ,but please do add more citations ,if possible web citations as it is quick to verify ,Thanks for your contributions once again, keep on contributing

To reply, leave a comment on Anoptimistix's talk page.

Learn more about page curation.

Anoptimistix (talk) 19:30, 4 July 2017 (UTC)

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Irish Pine / West Hematite

Hi, and thank you for your contributions to Wikipedia. It appears that you tried to give a page a different title by copying its content and pasting either the same content, or an edited version of it, into another page with a different name. This is known as a "cut-and-paste move", and it is undesirable because it splits the page history, which is legally required for attribution. Instead, the software used by Wikipedia has a feature that allows pages to be moved to a new title together with their edit history.

In most cases, once your account is four days old and has ten edits, you should be able to move an article yourself using the "Move" tab at the top of the page (the tab may be hidden in a dropdown menu for you). This both preserves the page history intact and automatically creates a redirect from the old title to the new. If you cannot perform a particular page move yourself this way (e.g. because a page already exists at the target title), please follow the instructions at requested moves to have it moved by someone else. Also, if there are any other pages that you moved by copying and pasting, even if it was a long time ago, please list them at Wikipedia:Requests for history merge. Thank you.

• I've restore the article and redirect to their previous states. Convention for ship articles is that ships are housed at a title which is most relevant for the ship in question, with redirects from alternative names. In this case, it is Irish Pine. Please do not make cut and paste moves, as it means that article history is lost, and WP:ATTRIBUTION is violated. If you feel really strongly that the article should be moved, please post a request at WP:RM and give your reasons there as to why you think the article should be moved. Any other questions, please ask. Mjroots (talk) 17:16, 5 December 2017 (UTC)

Italian submarine articles

I appreciate your recent work on Italian submarines, but you should know that image sizes for ship article are 300px, not 330px like you've been adding. And there's no need for two shipboxflags; the one for the Kingdom of Italy suffices unless the boat was still in service after the end of the Kingdom of Italy.--Sturmvogel 66 (talk) 19:57, 7 December 2017 (UTC)

Tembien

...may I ask where did you take this information for Italian submarine Tembien from?

"On June 26, 1941 she left the base to patrol off Cyrenaica. On June 29, 1941 at 20:41, Tembien sighted a formation of British ships off Ras Azzaz, a hundred miles east of Tobruk. The group was composed of destroyers HMS Defender and HMAS Waterhen sailing from Tobruk (besieged by the Axis forces) to Alexandria evacuating troops from the 6th Australian Division. The two destroyers were then attacked off Sollum by 19 Ju-87 "Stuka" bombers: twelve German from StG 1 of the Luftwaffe and seven Italian from the 239 Bomber Squadron. One of these, piloted by Ennio Tarantola, hit HMAS Waterhen on the stern with a 500 kg bomb causing flooding in engine rooms and forcing the crew to abandon the ship. Tembien approached to within 600 meters and tried to deliver coup de grâce to the immobilized destroyer, but HMS Defender detected the submarine, turned toward it and opened fire at it, forcing Tembien to hastily launch two torpedoes from the aft tubes and then quickly dive."

"HMS Hermione sustained only minor damage during collision. On her arrival in Malta, three hours later, a "piece" of Tembien was found crumpled around the cruiser's bow. Some of the scrap of the submarine was recovered and transformed into "souvenirs"."

--RegiaMarina (talk) 09:31, 22 December 2017 (UTC)

Howdy, you can find this right here http://www.lavocedelmarinaio.com/2014/08/il-regio-sommergibile-Tembien/ Merry Christmas! Crook1 (talk) 20:47, 22 December 2017 (UTC)

You should cite it as a source in the related page, then. As you should do with any webpages that you use as sources. Additionally, the page on "La voce del marinaio" that you linked does not contain many details that appear in your wiki page on Tembien, including the attack by the StG 1 and 239 Squadron aircraft, the distance of 600 meters, Ennio Tarantola, Defender's reaction (Defender is, in fact, not mentioned at all). As it happens, I know another page on the net that goes as follows: "Alle 20.41 il Tembien avvista una formazione di navi britanniche al largo di Ras Azzaz, un centinaio di miglia a levante di Tobruk: si tratta dei cacciatorpediniere Defender (capitano di corvetta Gilbert Lescombie Farnfield) e Waterhen (capitano di corvetta James Hamilton Swain), in navigazione da Tobruk (assediata dalle forze dell’Asse) ad Alessandria d’Egitto con truppe della 6a Divisione Australiana. Proprio mentre il Tembien li sta osservando, i due cacciatorpediniere vengono attaccati, al largo di Sollum, da 19 bombardieri in picchiata Junkers Ju 87 “Stuka”: dodici tedeschi (Sturzkampfgeschwader 1 della Luftwaffe) e sette italiani (239a Squadriglia da Bombardamento in picchiata della Regia Aeronautica, capitano Giuseppe Cenni). Uno di questi ultimi, pilotato dal maresciallo Ennio Tarantola, colpisce il Waterhen a poppa con una bomba da 500 kg. Il danno risulta subito gravissimo; le sale macchine e caldaie sono immediatamente allagate, e l’equipaggio inizia ad abbandonare la nave. Il Tembien tenta di avvicinarsi per impartire il colpo di grazia al cacciatorpediniere danneggiato, ma il Defender – che si sta anch’esso avvicinando, per prendere a rimorchio il Waterhen – lo avvista (poco lontano, a proravia) ed apre il fuoco contro di esso, costringendolo a lanciare alla cieca (due siluri, dai tubi poppieri, da meno di 600 metri) per poi immergersi rapidamente.

Per altra fonte, invece, il Tembien giunge avvista un cacciatorpediniere che sembra procedere a bassa velocità, distante 600 metri (il Waterhen, già danneggiato dall’attacco), lancia i siluri contro di esso e solo dopo il lancio viene avvistato e costretto a disimpegnarsi da un secondo cacciatorpediniere (il Defender), che tenta infruttuosamente di speronarlo. In ogni caso, i siluri non vanno a segno; il Tembien si disimpegna in immersione, eludendo la caccia con bombe di profondità senza subire danni. Il Waterhen, irrimediabilmente danneggiato dalla bomba, affonderà per conto proprio all’1.50 del giorno seguente, capovolgendosi in posizione 32°15’ N e 25°20’ E (sette miglia a nord di Sidi el Barrani), dopo un vano tentativo di rimorchio da parte del Defender." To me, it seems that it looks a lot like what is written there in the Tembien wiki page, even the wording is basically the same. Doesn't it? --Olonia (talk) 22:17, 22 December 2017 (UTC)

Durbo

Or, where did you take this from?

"In the afternoon of October 17, 1940 Durbo sighted a British destroyer, but captain Acanfora decided that the sea was too rough for an attack and decided to stay submerged for most of the following night to avoid detection. At 9:30 am on October 18, 1940 a Saunders Roe A. 27 "London" of the No. 202 Squadron RAF, piloted by Captain Percy R. Hatfield, sighted air bubbles and a small patch of oil while flying off the island of Alboran, 65 miles East of the Strait of Gibraltar. At this time, the crew of Durbo was trying to fix a leak in the compressed air system, which had always been a problem. Together with another seaplane Saunders Roe A. 27 "London" of the No. 202 Squadron RAF, piloted by Captain NF Eagleton, Hatfield dropped bombs at the location of the bubbles and the oil, then called in two British destroyers, HMS Firedrake and HMS Wrestler.

The bombs dropped by the aircraft exploded while the submarine was sailing at the periscope depth, and had not damaged Durbo, the submarine then dove down to 35 meters to avoid further attacks by the aircraft. However, with the arrival of British destroyers situation changed for the worse. At 10:00 the submarine went through the first heavy depth charge attack which damaged her torpedo room and fuel tanks thus making Durbo even more visible to her attackers. Durbo dove down to 58 meters and tried to get away at very low speed. At 13:30 the boat was hit by a second deep charge attack. At 16:30 Durbo went through a third depth charge attack, this time with devastating effect: all the instruments went out, the pumps were damaged. In addition, main propeller shafts were deformed, which made it difficult to maintain propulsion. The consequent flooding through the aft room sunk the stern, until the submarine reached an angle of 20 degrees and Durbo dropped down to 110 meters, thirty meters below her test depth. In addition, the coolant lines were damaged and chloromethane gas started leaking and poisoning the air. At 21:00, after eleven hours of hammering, with the badly damaged boat, continuously rising water, low air reserves and leaking chloromethane gas captain Acanfora ordered the boat to surface. At 21:30 Durbo appeared on the surface and captain Acanfora ordered to abandon the ship, destroy all secret documentation and codes, and scuttle the ship.

Durbo sank stern first at 21:50 on October 18, 1940 at the point 35°57′N 04°00′W with all 46 men of her crew (5 officers and 41 non-officers and sailors) rescued by HMS Firedrake."

--Olonia (talk) 15:16, 22 December 2017 (UTC). I am the same guy, in case you are wondering.

No, my friend, you did not use "Pitchfork".

"In the afternoon of October 17, 1940 Durbo sighted a British destroyer, but captain Acanfora decided that the sea was too rough for an attack and decided to stay submerged for most of the following night to avoid detection. At 9:30 am on October 18, 1940 a Saunders Roe A. 27 "London" of the No. 202 Squadron RAF, piloted by Captain Percy R. Hatfield, sighted air bubbles and a small patch of oil while flying off the island of Alboran, 65 miles East of the Strait of Gibraltar. At this time, the crew of Durbo was trying to fix a leak in the compressed air system, which had always been a problem. Together with another seaplane Saunders Roe A. 27 "London" of the No. 202 Squadron RAF, piloted by Captain NF Eagleton, Hatfield dropped bombs at the location of the bubbles and the oil, then called in two British destroyers, HMS Firedrake and HMS Wrestler."

"Nel pomeriggio del 17 ottobre il Durbo avvistò un cacciatorpediniere britannico, ma il comandante Acanfora ritenne che il mare fosse troppo mosso per poter tentare un attacco. L’incontro con la nave da guerra nemica, tuttavia, mise Acanfora sul chi va là, così che questi decise di restare immerso anche per la maggior parte della notte seguente, contrariamente a quanto fatto nei giorni precedenti. Alle 9.30 (o dieci) del mattino del 18 ottobre, però, l’idrovolante Saunders Roe A. 27 “London” K 5913 del 202nd Squadron della Royal Air Force, pilotato dal capitano Percy R. Hatfield (in seguito protagonista della ricerca ed individuazione in Atlantico della corazzata tedesca Bismarck), avvistò delle bolle d’aria ed una piccola chiazza di carburante mentre volava al largo dell’isola di Alboran, 65 miglia ad est dello stretto di Gibilterra: erano le tracce del Durbo. A bordo del sommergibile, infatti, l’equipaggio stava cercando di riparare una perdita al sistema dell’aria compressa, che aveva sempre dato problemi. Insieme ad un altro idrovolante “London” del 202nd Squadron, pilotato dal capitano N. F. Eagleton, Hatfield sganciò le proprie bombe sopra il punto da cui provenivano le bolle ed il carburante, poi richiamò sul posto due cacciatorpediniere britannici, il Firedrake (capitano di corvetta Stephen Hugh Norris, che per l’azione avrebbe ricevuto il Distinguished Service Order), distaccato dalla scorta del convoglio «HG 45», ed il Wrestler (tenente di vascello Eric Lister Jones). Uno dei due giunse il mattino stesso, seguito nel pomeriggio dal secondo; avvistata una vasta chiazza di carburante, le due navi ottennero presto un contatto al sonar."

Do you recognize it? You didn't even bother changing the words. --Olonia (talk) 09:10, 23 December 2017 (UTC)

Listen, if you are accusing me of something then state it. Also if you own any specific website, please state it and provide proof, it will also help us to see if you quote your own website anywhere. Most Italian websites I found cannot be referenced because their info is unreferenced and hence it's unknown where the info had come from. Therefore any info that was put here is subject to independent corroboration through books or official government websites, or through renowned historians. I don't even quote Uboat.net because it is a secondary source. That's why info on submarines is unreferenced in many places. I will keep this info here only to the extent that I can confirm it from the reliable sources. If you have Italian sources then please contribute by inserting references (books, not websites). If you want the unreferenced info to be removed, or modified, then again state so and give your reasoning, and stop playing your stupid riddles! Crook1 (talk) 15:54, 23 December 2017 (UTC)

Sure. I accuse you of copy-pasting-translating information from this website, as clearly shown by the two passages that I have quoted above (which are just two examples), without referencing it. And, yes, I happen to be the author of said site, and with all the time that I've spent searching through books and websites and writing those pages, it irritates me a lot that some guy comes and copies what I have written into Wikipedia, without giving any credit. The site cannot be referenced? Very well: then, since it is not reliable enough to be referenced, you do not use it at all. Instead, you have abundantly used (better: copy, fair and square) information from this (unreliable) site, and then you omitted referencing it as it would look bad if it appeared that you are using an unreliable source for your articles. If you don't want to reference it, then remove all the detail that comes from there and only use the information that comes from sources that you deem reliable enough and are ready to reference. If a site is not reliable enough to be referenced, then it's not reliable enough to be used at all. That's my reasoning. Feel better now? --Olonia (talk) 19:36, 23 December 2017 (UTC)